Stats primer for the 2016 Sutherland Cup* (aka, The Asterisk Series)

[Qwerty]

Okay all you Jr B nerds, chew on this for a while...

The following data, calculated from figures available on the GOJHL website and Eliteprospects.com, compare the combined statistical averages of the top 9 forwards, 6 defensemen and lead goaltender for each of the four teams that have advanced to this year's GOJHL Jr. B league championship: Caledonia Corvairs, Stratford Cullitons, London Nationals and Waterloo Siskins.

Basically, these data compare the top 3 lines for each team that is vying for the bragging rights to the Sutherland Cup which represents Jr. B hockey supremacy in southwestern Ontario. What makes this championship particularly noteworthy is that the GOJHL is considered to be the best Jr. B hockey league in North America. See article at: http://thejuniorhockeynews.com/?p=45135

The teams are listed below in order of each team's respective seeding.

For the purposes of this statistical comparison, the top 16 players for each team have been identified on the basis of the total number of points they have accumulated thus far during the 2016 GOJHL post season.

Interpret the data as you will and reach your own conclusions about the nature of the competition that will be seen by Jr. B hockey fans over the course of the next two weeks. I hope you find these data informative. I particularly hope that members of the mainstream media, looking for interesting storylines to report on in the days and weeks ahead, will find them helpful.

AVERAGE AGE OF TEAM'S TOP 16 PLAYERS:
Corvairs: 20 years and 7 months
Cullitons: 19 years and 9 months
Nationals: 19 years and 9 months
Siskins: 19 years and 0 months

AVERAGE # OF GAMES PLAYED IN THE OHL (or QMJHL)
Corvairs: 77.43 games (combined total among top 16 players of 1239 games)
Cullitons: 1.19 games (combined total among top 16 players of 19 games)
Nationals: 3.56 games (combined total among top 16 players of 57 games)
Siskins: 0.38 games (combined total among top 16 players of 6 games)

NUMBER OF PLAYERS WHO HAVE PLAYED GAMES IN THE OHL (or QMJHL)
Corvairs: 9 out of the top 16
Cullitons: 4 out of the top 16
Nationals: 4 out of the top 16
Siskin: 1 out of the top 16

NUMBER PLAYERS WHO PLAYED FULL SEASONS IN THE OHL LAST YEAR
Corvairs: 8 out of the top 16
Cullitons: 0 out of the top 16
Nationals: 0 out of the top 16
Siskins: 0 out of the top 16

NUMBER OF PLAYERS WHO PLAYED MULTIPLE FULL SEASONS IN THE OHL PRIOR TO THIS YEAR
Corvairs: 8 out of the top 16
Cullitons: 0 out of the top 16
Nationals: 0 out of the top 16
Siskins: 0 out of the top 16

NUMBER OF PLAYERS WHO HAVE PLAYED MORE GAMES IN THE OHL THAN IN THE GOJHL
Corvairs: 8 out of the top 16
Cullitons: 0 out of the top 16
Nationals: 0 out of the top 16
Siskins: 0 out of the top 16

NUMBER OF PLAYERS WHO PLAYED FOR THEIR CURRENT TEAM LAST SEASON
Corvairs: 5 out of the top 16
Cullitons: 9 out of the top 16
Nationals: 10 out of the top 16
Siskins: 3 out of the top 16

NUMBER OF PLAYERS WHO ARE YOUNGER THAN 19 YRS & 0 MONTHS
Corvairs: 1 out of the top 16
Cullitons: 4 out of the top 16
Nationals: 5 out of the top 16
Siskins: 7 out of the top 16

NUMBER OF PLAYERS WHO ARE YOUNGER THAN 18 YRS & 0 MONTHS
Corvairs: 0 out of the top 16
Cullitons: 1 out of the top 16
Nationals: 1 out of the top 16
Siskins: 3 out of the top 16

AVERAGE HEIGHT AND WEIGHT OF TOP 16 PLAYERS
Corvairs: 6 ft, 1 inches - 193.37 lbs
Cullitons: 6 ft, 0 inches - 187.94 lbs
Nationals: 5 ft, 11 inches - 186.19 lbs
Siskins: 5 ft, 11 inches - 177.38 lbs

TEAM ADVOCATING TO LEAVE THE GOJHL AND ENTER A JR. A LEAGUE BECAUSE GOJHL QUALITY IS NOT HIGH ENOUGH
Corvairs: Yes (See story: http://www.sachem.ca/sports-story/64821 ... -junior-a/)
Cullitons: No
Nationals: No
Siskins: No

TEAM AFTER WHICH A NEW GOJHL RULE HAS BEEN NAMED TO LIMIT THE # OF 20-YR-OLD AND FORMER MAJOR JR. A LEVEL PLAYERS A GOJHL JR. B TEAM CAN CARRY ON ITS ROSTER
Corvairs: Yes (See story: http://www.wellandtribune.ca/2016/03/29 ... e-per-team)
Cullitons: No
Nationals: No
Siskins: No

TOTAL # OF 1995 BIRTH-YEAR PLAYERS ON TEAM ROSTER
Corvairs: 19 (including 1 affiliated player) http://gojhlcms.stats.pointstreak.com/t ... onid=15492
Cullitons: 7 (including 0 affiliated players) http://gojhlcms.stats.pointstreak.com/t ... onid=15492
Nationals: 9 (including 0 affiliated players) http://gojhlcms.stats.pointstreak.com/t ... onid=15492
Siskins: 2 (including 0 affiliated players) http://gojhlcms.stats.pointstreak.com/t ... onid=15492

A FINAL NOTE & REMINDER:
The GOJHL is regarded as the best Jr. B hockey league in North America, according to the Jr. Hockey News: http://thejuniorhockeynews.com/?p=45135

The GOJHL was also ranked by The Hockey Writers in 2013 as the 8th best overall development league -- professional or amateur in North America. This puts the GOJHL one spot behind the OJHL -- a ranking that has long been contested by many. http://www.cksn.ca/2013/07/gojhl-named- ... h-america/

[Cali vairs!]

Wow take more of a shot at Cali why don't you

[GoWest]

Bravo Qwerty. It's common knowledge the team is built on under the table player payments.

Those ex-OHL kids have never even heard of the Sutherland cup.

[Port hockey1]

As soon as you said the Asterisk series you lost credibility. Those are reserved for cheaters. Caledonia isn't cheating.

More like David vs Goliath... Or the class of the league vs the whining fans from around the GOJHL

[Port hockey1]

....

[Port hockey1]

Wow take more of a shot at Cali why don't you

It's easy to pick stats that suit a persons argument. My favorites were the ones he just made up. Like saying it's the Caledonia rule just because a paper reports that. Isn't the GOJHL's official release worded much different..

Also the fact that Niagara Falls & Brampton weren't mentioned as teams that wanted out.

And Asterisk.... Pretty sure Caledonia plays by the rules and have gotten the GOJHL a whole lot of exposure over the last several years.

A creatively worded stats pack... Boy, the complainers are really grasping at straws now.

This is how fans treat a team that's attracted scouts out of the ying-yang.... And has sent countless players off to higher levels.

Yup, this league's a joke alright. But it's the fans making it into one. They should direct their anger towards the people down at the leagues office who wrote the rules in a manner to allow Caledonia to load up like this.

Say's a lot about those who are upset, uneducated anger being directed towards the classiest organization in the GOJHL when it should directed at the league's office!

I hope this does get media attention. Because I'll gladly send them a list of the countless players Caledonia has developed, including the AHL's top defensemen.

This post isn't directed at any specific person, just to those in general that are ragging on Caledonia for putting this league on the map!

Soon they'll set history. To the many supporters out there...

To the many jealous haters out there... Pretty soon you can come kiss their rings!

[Port hockey1]

Bravo Qwerty. It's common knowledge the team is built on under the table player payments.

Those ex-OHL kids have never even heard of the Sutherland cup.

You mean those same payments countless other teams handout... Funny how there's that big double standard.

[Cali vairs!]

Cali is playing within the current rules. I don't get why theirs so much whining about it. Every team has the same opportunity to do this. The fans of those teams must be blind to this fact. Tons of teams try the exact stuff as Cali and come up short (St kitts and Kitchener for example). Just because Cali has been succulent this year by doing it they get all the blame for it. Look at last year for example. They were the complete opposite. Didn't have as much skill, but had older players. You can develop older players. If you disagree than you better stop watching the league

[Port hockey1]

Cali is playing within the current rules. I don't get why theirs so much whining about it. Every team has the same opportunity to do this. The fans of those teams must be blind to this fact. Tons of teams try the exact stuff as Cali and come up short (St kitts and Kitchener for example). Just because Cali has been succulent this year by doing it they get all the blame for it. Look at last year for example. They were the complete opposite. Didn't have as much skill, but had older players. You can develop older players. If you disagree than you better stop watching the league

Well said.

[Qwerty]

Friends, please don't misinterpret a statement of facts as passing judgement. The facts are what they are, and I challenge anyone to correct me on anything I wrote above. The advantage the Corvairs have created for themselves through their recruiting practices this year is evident in the facts. They have assembled more -- more than twice as many more -- experienced, older, bigger players than any other team in the Sutherland championship. A majority of their top three lines are bona fide Major Jr A players. They've recruited these players within the league's rules as they currently stand.

But those rules are changing, and they are changing precisely because what the Corvairs were permitted to do this year is seen by many -- that is, a vast majority of the league teams and league officials -- as a problem.

So, this year, we get to watch Caledonia, in all likelihood, walk through their play-off competition toward a third championship in what is regarded as the best Jr B (i.e., development) league in North America. But, then again, who knows. Maybe there will be a surprise ending. That's why they play the games. One things is for sure: history will be made this year. All that remains to be seen is what The Asterisk will mean when it appears in the history books.

[Cali vairs!]

Somewhat correct qwerty. A lot of these players have played in this league before and have been so called developed. Look at some of the corvairs players who have been on the team for years.
Ratchford- likely the best defence in the league. Amazing puck mover who would be on the top line for any team in those league. 3rd years with the vairs.
Moran- 3rd year. Great 3rd line defence. Strong defencive defenseman that could be on the second line on almost every other team.
Bianchi- 2nd year (last year partly with hagersville)- what some people don't realize is that corvairs do a great job developing in hagersville. He's a perfect example. Still young and he will be a great elite defenseman. He has been showing in the playoffs what he really can be.
Fletcher- again with hagersville. He has been an amazing body in the playoffs. He works his butt of every shift. Still young.
Rimac- 2 years (one with hagersville). Great player. Can play any style. Physical, defensive, offensive. Great team player.
Their is even more as well. Pretty impressive for a team who recruits everybody. Has some pretty elite players developed.

[Qwerty]

Cali, I'm totally correct. What I pointed out is that the majority of your top 16 have played significant games in the OHL, several of them multiple seasons, and several of them over-age trade deadline additions. I've never suggested there weren't non-ex Jr A players on Calendonia's roster -- just very few relative to the rest of the league. And it's interesting you choose to name two call-ups from Hagersville Jr C to highlight how the Corvairs develop home-grown talent. NOW I understand why they signed Davis Brown, a 5-season over-age veteran of the Sarnia Sting from the London area, to Hagersville. There's a classic example of how Corvairs develop young talent. I suppose DB is there to mentor the young pups on what they need to do to make it to the show. Gee, and here I thought he was there to pad the Corvairs injury/suspension reserve just in case they needed a little extra Jr A fire power coming down the backstretch. I'm sure Jr C hockey is going to do a lot to help advance his career to the next level.

[Cali vairs!]

That's never been done before qwerty. I never said that you were wrong with the points you made, but your missing pretty substantial talent that they did develop. People always focus on the negatives. You can never win when your in first. I've only been following the league for 4 years now. But your telling me no other team has had these problems. And I love that people throw the # of 20 year olds in. If their so dominant than why are they aloud in the league? The problem is CHL experience. Im not gonna argue with you about that. Something needs to be done but it's a hard thing to do. Even though I'm a huge fan of Cali it would be nice in some ways to see them lose. Only argument anybody ever has against Cali to prove that their such a evil team is the age and OHL experience. Like it or not Cali raises the level of play in the league. It gives some of the kids a better opurtunity to develop and know what it takes to get in the OHL and stay their for a couple years. Don't be mad at a team just because they win

[Port hockey1]

Cali, I'm totally correct. What I pointed out is that the majority of your top 16 have played significant games in the OHL, several of them multiple seasons, and several of them over-age trade deadline additions. I've never suggested there weren't non-ex Jr A players on Calendonia's roster -- just very few relative to the rest of the league. And it's interesting you choose to name two call-ups from Hagersville Jr C to highlight how the Corvairs develop home-grown talent. NOW I understand why they signed Davis Brown, a 5-season over-age veteran of the Sarnia Sting from the London area, to Hagersville. There's a classic example of how Corvairs develop young talent. I suppose DB is there to mentor the young pups on what they need to do to make it to the show. Gee, and here I thought he was there to pad the Corvairs injury/suspension reserve just in case they needed a little extra Jr A fire power coming down the backstretch. I'm sure Jr C hockey is going to do a lot to help advance his career to the next level.

Unlike the Chatham situation, Brown played several games for his Jr.C club. If that didn't help develop those kids down there in your eye's, you must really have an agenda.

Again, where's this Asterisk come in???

And none of those ex CHL players would have a significant role at that level anymore. Either be warming the bench or they'd be healthy scratches. Several of them are also ex GOJHL players.

They don't have any legit OHL players on their team. None of them would do much in the OHL. Pawley couldn't buy a point there.

The difference is Caledonia gets the most out of these kids. When the Falcons load up on ex OHL players, they don't get the effort out of them Caledonia gets. Evans & Felker would've been top players on Caledonia... But their lack of effort is probably why they didn't get the chance!

There's two sides to every story my friend.

[Cali vairs!]

Totally agree port

[Qwerty]

Yeah, you're right again, Port. Pawley couldn't buy a point in the O. Except for the 70 he scored over two seasons with the Frontenacs.

And Bauman was a lame duck when he was in the O. Except for being a top-4 d-man with Guleph when they played for and narrowly missed winning the Memorial Cup in 2014 final. Who knows... had Chadd not been suspended late in the tourney for a knee-on-knee hit, the Storm may have won it.

I could go on, but I'll save some for later.

You know, Port, there are a few people on this forum who know a thing or two about hockey. For an apparent fan of the Corvairs and Jr B hockey, you surprise me by how dismissive (and wrong) you often are about the talent of so many players and teams in this league.

[Port hockey1]

Yeah, you're right again, Port. Pawley couldn't buy a point in the O. Except for the 70 he scored over two seasons with the Frontenacs.

And Bauman was a lame duck when he was in the O. Except for being a top-4 d-man with Guleph when they played for and narrowly missed winning the Memorial Cup in 2014 final. Who knows... had Chadd not been suspended late in the tourney for a knee-on-knee hit, the Storm may have won it.

I could go on, but I'll save some for later.

You know, Port, there are a few people on this forum who know a thing or two about hockey. For an apparent fan of the Corvairs and Jr B hockey, you surprise me by how dismissive (and wrong) you often are about the talent of so many players and teams in this league.

Pawley had good line mates. I don't remember Bauman being a top 4... But I may be wrong.

[Qwerty]

Cali, by your own admission, "CHL talent is the problem." Thank you for seeing the facts. Now, take away Caledonia's 20-year-old CHL vets (NOT the guys you've mentioned like Moran and Ratchford) and what are you left with? I'll tell you: a Jr B team that belongs in the GO.

Port, I guess Pawley has some pretty good line mates this season, too, since he's leading the reg and post-season scoring race. And I can assure you that Bauman was top 4 in Guelph - a great player.

[Cali vairs!]

Baumann left the O because they wanted him to play forward and he didn't want to play forward. For the last 1 or 2 years they forced him to play it. That's why he switched to jr b.

If you pay attention they have no other choice where to go. I don't see one player on a team that wanted to come down from the O. But now that they did come down and love it. So qwerty like it or not, there is likely gonna be more CHL players next year on every team. The new rules still alow players like pawley, DB, etc. like I said the problem is with CHL players. If they have ready played a year in the GO then their fine to play

[Cali vairs!]

And look at a team like Kitchener. They pick up players from the O all the time. Hell their goalie was going back and forth every weekend. Why doesn't ever criticize them. Is it because they didn't win?

[Oglethorp]

Kitchener is the Rangers affiliate so many of the players they have are sent to them. It isn't the same. As for Baumann he was not a key piece for Guelph in their Memorial Cup run and was often used as a 4th line forward that year as well. Many of the Cali 20 year olds would have been bubble kids for an OA spot in the OHL, where as most teams 20 year olds are JrB vets. There is a difference.

[Qwerty]

Cali, it's a matter of degree and horrific optics.

The league is trying to mitigate the problem which is why they introduced the new rule to limit the # of 20 yr olds and place some restrictions/disincentives on loading up with CHLers in what is what is a Jr. B development league (thus the league's feeble attempt to count some CHLers as two cards... which won't work because of the loop-hole that players who spent time previously in the GO will be exempted).

The league HAD to do something because the optics are so bad this year it was getting out of hand. They got an overwhelming amount of support for the new rule because it was so painfully obvious the Corvairs went too far this year. A majority of people who watch and care about the game recognize that. Frankly, I'm not convinced the new rule has gone far enough, but at least it's something and a step in the right direction.

I get that CHL over-agers run out of options on where they can play, but they do have options. They all graduate with scholarship money to play CIS, and most university teams salivate at the opportunity to recruit these guys, provided they're smart enough to get in. If there was a more even distribution of these guys around the league, then that would be more palatable because it would lead to more parity and competitive games -- rather than the 17-1 gong shows we saw vs. Pelham. Yes, I know, Pelham is a separate problem, but it's related to the same issue: creating parity, which should always be a top priority for the league. But at the end of the day, why should a 20 year old who has had a good run in CHL hockey take priority over a younger kid who deserves a shot at playing Jr B hockey. Let me repeat: Jr B hockey -- not Major Jr A hockey. If CHL vets want to keep playing, let them go to the OJHL.

Bottom line is this. The new league rule says you can carry a maximum of nine 20-year-olds. The Corvairs have more than twice that -- 19 players (including APs) who are 20 years old. Eight of the top 16 regular roster spots are occupied by young men who played in the OHL last season, after playing in the OHL for multiple seasons. One of Caledonia's so-called "Jr C APJs" (D Brown, a third-round draft pick to Sarnia Sting who played 193 games in the OHL) was on the game sheet again last night, making it his 13th appearance with the Corvairs. Nobody's criticizing Kitchener (at least this year) because they had a grand total of seven 20-year-olds on their team, and their top 3 point-getters are all 1996 birth-year kids who have played their entire junior hockey career in the GO.

Port, if you haven't figured out what The Asterisk will mean this year, you're not thinking hard enough.

[Port hockey1]

Pawley, Davis Brown, etc. These are former GOJHL players. OHL time or not, they've been here before. No different than Leamington picking up Manchurek.

I get your point though, too many of these ex CHL players on one team. And you know, if they did this all the time I'd be on your side. But when you look at their previous teams, they've had fewer 20 year olds than some of the other teams.

But where do we draw the line? Will we be complaining that LaSalle gets too many good young Jr.C players, and that they aren't being evenly distributed? Seriously, a team loads up once, and it turns into a supreme court case.

I've looked very hard, I just don't see the Asterisk.

[Jean Ratchford]

Would it make you feel better to know that Todd is about 11 hours short of being a 96? I don't understand why some of you are so quick to cast away a KID because he's 20! Why not let them see where the opportunity takes them in the GOJHL?? When you play against tougher competition It can and sometimes will make you step up your game. 20 years olds lives matter too! How is it fair to cut them short. I was always told ""if your good enough you will make it" . Who really gives a s&%$ how old they are...talent is talent and the Corvairs scout the best. It a that simple no need to be haters really all that does it weaken the league with all the bs. My kid came into this league from AA and guess what he made it at 17. There shouldn't be a restriction on development because of someones age. I don't like participation medals Nd all the political correctness of today's society and I sure as hell don't like not giving a KID a chance because he's all of a sudden too old

[Qwerty]

No one has a problem with your son, Mrs Ratchford. The problem is how many 20 yr olds your son's team has, and, more importantly, how many of them have played most of their career in the OHL. It's not complicated to understand. Why do you think the OHL limits the number of 20 year olds a team can carry to three? Think about it; the BEST development league in the world LIMITS the # of 20 yr olds a team can carry to 3. If age doesn't matter, as you suggest, then let's open the gates up and let 21, 22, 23, 24 year olds in. Why not? More talent and more experience can only make things better, right?

[Jean Ratchford]

I guess you are having a hard time understanding my post. It goes w/o saying the the AGE LIMIT is 20 and this is not complicated as you say it is. I COMPLETELY understand what some think is the problem...but that doesn't nesscicsarly make it one. The sarcasim of Todd's age went over your head I guess.

[three dog night]

It all right to have Caledonia or any other team with seventeen plus 20 year old on the roster I was wondering why there was not a rule for any given game you can dress only up to eight or nine of these players.

[number 17]

Mrs. Ratchford it would be interesting for the rest of us to know how much Todd is being paid to play for the Corvairs? Or what might Pawley be getting financially to play his last season of eligibility. It's not close to a level playing field. It's not about scouting it's about ownership and dollars under the table, teams like Caledonia ruin the competitive fairness of the league. Eventually they destroy the meaning of true competition and rules have to be made to close loopholes.Scouting in Caledonia equates to dollars being handed out, that's why there's an asterisk. Yes, there will always be some financial shenanigans but the ownership in Caledonia has taken it to a new level.

[Cali vairs!]

They aren't ruining it for other people In my mind. Obviously you haven't see most of the teams play us. It makes other teams strive and play as hard as they can to beat us. I think it develops more talent at a higher rate. But now what are these 20 year olds going to do that any get a roster spot? They might have to go to jr c. Than jr c will have higher competition than the GO. Tell me how this new rule is gonna help the league. Than you have a argument.

[Port hockey1]

Would it make you feel better to know that Todd is about 11 hours short of being a 96? I don't understand why some of you are so quick to cast away a KID because he's 20! Why not let them see where the opportunity takes them in the GOJHL?? When you play against tougher competition It can and sometimes will make you step up your game. 20 years olds lives matter too! How is it fair to cut them short. I was always told ""if your good enough you will make it" . Who really gives a s&%$ how old they are...talent is talent and the Corvairs scout the best. It a that simple no need to be haters really all that does it weaken the league with all the bs. My kid came into this league from AA and guess what he made it at 17. There shouldn't be a restriction on development because of someones age. I don't like participation medals Nd all the political correctness of today's society and I sure as hell don't like not giving a KID a chance because he's all of a sudden too old

Very well stated!!!