Can anyone stop Caledonia in a best of seven series?

[GoWest]

Do the events described in the articles below sound somewhat familiar to what is going on this season in the GOJHL?

If this team is the poster-child of the league, as some here would suggest, then I'm sure they'd be happy to open their books for an OHA audit.


Junior hockey's dirty little secret
Friday, December 10, 2010 4:35:39 EST PM
http://www.woodstocksentinelreview.com/ ... tle-secret



Oops, Gotcha!

Paying for players?
Fri., Nov 04, 2011
http://m.cambridgetimes.ca/sports-story ... r-players-



OHA Rule J25: PLAYER COMPENSATION J25 Any executive or staff member of an O .H .A . team who knowingly compensates a player financially for his services or is party to, or has knowledge of such an undertaking, other than for reasonable out-of-pocket expenses, will be subject to an automatic suspension which will be determined upon investigation of the incident . Any player who seeks or accepts compensation outside regulation J25, will be subject to an automatic suspension the length of which will be determined by the appointed Committee reviewing the matter. NOTE: Reasonable expenses includes protective equipment, sticks and skates, travel expenses and educational expenses and/or room and board if the player is required to relocate to join his team.

[Vairs61]

I think it's more their ability to out bid teams for releases. Plus kids want to be on a winner, that's the biggest draw.

[RocketGirl]

Thanks guys. I wasn't sure what kind of response I would get from it, but overall it's been pretty good.

One thing I didn't put in, because I couldn't find the right spot for it, but I'm not against Caledonia. I know that right now, as it stands, my team is not at the same calibre to be able to compete against them, and that doesn't bother me.

And like I said, they are playing within the signing rules, they're playing fast and loose with them, but they're still playing within them. As was said while Chatham was going through their import issue a few years ago, they've found a loophole and have exploited it. But that's when rules get changed. So we'll just have to see how this plays out in the off-season.

[Port hockey1]

I've been quiet on the topic because I was writing this opinion piece about it. How Many Is Too Many? My take on the issue of 20 year olds.

http://overtimesportsnation.com/how-many-is-too-many/

I enjoyed that article until I got to the bottom. Caledonia developed the currant leading scorer in defense points, in the AHL. What about Murphy?

Interesting take. It's what have you done for me lately? Because you downplayed all the players they've recently developed when you said they aren't developing anyone this season. If your team was in position to set league history with a third straight Championship, would you wan't them to worry about getting it done, or would you rather see them take a development approach?(honest question)

Saying that they aren't developing anyone this year is also untrue. J.C. Thivierge moved up to the QMJHL, and Matt Rimac is getting experience as a younger player, playing with kids that have skill sets he's never seen. Jonathon Pace was traded to a team where he'll get more ice time. Most teams would've let him sit the rest of the year for next season. Not Caledonia, classy enough to keep his development moving.

It seems to me that you made an attempt to be unbiased in your article... Until you ignored the above, and lied(accidentally?) when you said they haven't developed anyone this season. A good journalist digs deep and presents facts. You did that really good until you tilted it at the end, imo. <<<To be fair though, maybe you overlooked the above?


My take on the ex OHL players... Make a rule that says teams can only carry 2 or 3 players who've played a minimum of the last 2 consecutive years in the CHL.

[RocketGirl]

Well Port, I expected you to not be entirely happy with what I wrote. I also was not surprised by the message that I received from Caledonia last night.

This is my opinion on the situation, and as your signature says, I speak my mind and you don't always have to agree.

Since you mentioned Rimac, he's now on a Jr. C card. Yes, he'll have gained some valuable experience and development playing with Caledonia, and continuing to play up with them, but they've moved him to a C card.

Overall, I feel that they're not developing this season. That's just my opinion.

[quote="Port hockey1"]If your team was in position to set league history with a third straight Championship, would you wan't them to worry about getting it done, or would you rather see them take a development approach?(honest question)/quote]

In all honesty, I'd want my team to do it honestly. And perhaps Caledonia feels that they are. They are using their resources to build the best team they can. That's what I'd want from my team, but it's blatantly obvious what they are doing and again, in my opinion, it goes against the spirit of competition.

[Port hockey1]

Unread postby 99ersRock » Wed Jan 20, 2016 7:46 am

OHAHockeyFan. We get. Your jealous of the Corvairs cause your team in Thorold sucks. We're sorry. My team the 99ers suck but you can't denie Caledonia does develop players- AHL, NCAA D3, CIS, Europe , QMJHL, AJHL so you can't say that they don't. There not a team full of idiots there a team with a love for the game who stand up for each other. Wish we had there skill and desire in Brsntford...

Just an example of how well Caledonia develops players.

[Port hockey1]

Well Port, I expected you to not be entirely happy with what I wrote. I also was not surprised by the message that I received from Caledonia last night.

This is my opinion on the situation, and as your signature says, I speak my mind and you don't always have to agree.

Since you mentioned Rimac, he's now on a Jr. C card. Yes, he'll have gained some valuable experience and development playing with Caledonia, and continuing to play up with them, but they've moved him to a C card.

Overall, I feel that they're not developing this season. That's just my opinion.

If your team was in position to set league history with a third straight Championship, would you wan't them to worry about getting it done, or would you rather see them take a development approach?(honest question)/quote]

In all honesty, I'd want my team to do it honestly. And perhaps Caledonia feels that they are. They are using their resources to build the best team they can. That's what I'd want from my team, but it's blatantly obvious what they are doing and again, in my opinion, it goes against the spirit of competition.

Well said. I wasn't trying to be critical, just in disagreement with the end. I actually edited my post a few times, because I didn't want to make it look like I was being ignorant, or taking a shot at you.

I think it was really well written. Nothing wrong with difference of opinion.

[Caledonia Fan]

Well Port, I expected you to not be entirely happy with what I wrote. I also was not surprised by the message that I received from Caledonia last night.

This is my opinion on the situation, and as your signature says, I speak my mind and you don't always have to agree.

Since you mentioned Rimac, he's now on a Jr. C card. Yes, he'll have gained some valuable experience and development playing with Caledonia, and continuing to play up with them, but they've moved him to a C card.

Overall, I feel that they're not developing this season. That's just my opinion.

If your team was in position to set league history with a third straight Championship, would you wan't them to worry about getting it done, or would you rather see them take a development approach?(honest question)/quote]

In all honesty, I'd want my team to do it honestly. And perhaps Caledonia feels that they are. They are using their resources to build the best team they can. That's what I'd want from my team, but it's blatantly obvious what they are doing and again, in my opinion, it goes against the spirit of competition.

My understanding is Rimac wanted to go to Hagersville to stay in the Caledonia system.Just like the other 5 guys they have down there developing.
Is this not developing players, play in Hagersville and get the call up to Caledonia. Come playoffs if Hagersville get beat out you all get called up to Caledonia. Last year Rimac got a game in the Sutherland cup final. Bianchi played in game 6 in Lasalla

[Vairs61]

I guess it comes down to what you see as development. Is a 20 yr player that comes down a level to get more ice time a bad thing? Tyler Hill was told (written in an article) that his ice time was going to be reduced based on where the Storm were in the standings. He had options to stay, be traded or go back home and play with the Corvairs.
Other 20yr Corvair players did not have a spot on OHL teams. Most want to play next year at school and a few want a chance at pro hockey. Do you not consider this development? Sounds more like sour grapes.
At the end of the day they are young guys playing in a league in which they are still of age to play.

[RocketGirl]

We are never going to agree on this and all be on the same page. You have your position, I have mine, and everybody else has there's. But perception is everything. You perceive that I have sour grapes, which I don't. In all honesty, I'm indifferent on Caledonia. All 23 guys could be 20, and from the OHL, and it makes no different to me. Where my team is right now, we are not at the level to be able to compete with them, or for the Sutherland Cup in general, so this doesn't affect me at all.

The reason why I wrote this is because it's a hot button topic and that's what I do. When Chatham ran into their import issue 2 years ago, I wrote about it. Then when St. Catharines ran into it and it looked similar to Chatham's, but they didn't receive the same punishment, I wrote about it. When the rules change, I write about it. When Stratford ran into issues last season with Mitch Vandergunst, I wrote about it. Writing opinion pieces is what I like to do. I feel that it's where I shine and if I could write an opinion piece every week, rather than my previews or reviews, I would, but there's not enough interesting things to write about.

Now, back to perception, a lot of people, not just myself, perceive that they are not developing players, THIS SEASON. I never said anything about last season or the seasons before. I was talking about this season in particular.

In their message to me, Caledonia said that there are a lot of things that they do that myself and the public do not see. That's true of every team. There are things that my Dad and my brother do for the Rockets that, unless you're in the organization, you don't know about.

As an outsider, for this season, it is perceived that unless you have played in the OHL, and have played 100 games or more in the O, you are not good enough to be a Caledonia Corvair. That is how it looks to the rest of us, especially after I broke down their roster. There are guys that were on their team last year, that helped them win a Sutherland Cup, that were traded away this season to make room for Corey Pawley and Tyler Hill and Mitch Fitzmorris and Quentin Maksimovich and etc. This makes it look to the rest of us, at least in my opinion, that the players they had are not good enough for them now.

[Oglethorp]

I guess it comes down to what you see as development. Is a 20 yr player that comes down a level to get more ice time a bad thing? Tyler Hill was told (written in an article) that his ice time was going to be reduced based on where the Storm were in the standings. He had options to stay, be traded or go back home and play with the Corvairs.
Other 20yr Corvair players did not have a spot on OHL teams. Most want to play next year at school and a few want a chance at pro hockey. Do you not consider this development? Sounds more like sour grapes.
At the end of the day they are young guys playing in a league in which they are still of age to play.

It comes down to what the league is developing players for. More to the point what are the leagues objectives? The GOJHL has claimed to be a development league with the objective to move players on to higher levels. Often enough they cite the OHL and NCAA as higher levels. For the ex-OHL Corvairs, the OHL route is "been there, done that" and they are not eligible for NCAA. They could be "developing" for CIS but more likely a shot at the ECHL or a similar minor pro league. In reality the 20 year olds could play there now but need to be on the ice somewhere until their time comes, but they will be competing with the kids coming directly from major junior for those spots. Good luck with that. The Corvairs have traded some young players but have also sent younger player to Jr C so they can call them up if needed. Do players develop better in JrB or JrC? Most would think JrB. As far as players being seen, again how many OHL and NCAA scouts will be interested in taking in a game filled with ex-OHL players? Will these scouts go to watch many JrC games? Not likely. In reality the only likely outcome will be another banner in the Corvairs barn at the expense of developing young players.

The GOJHL needs to make up their mind what they mean by development as well. The Corvairs are playing within the GOJHL rules, so what they are doing this year is fair, with questionable ethics. Earlier this year the league decided that there would be no All Star Game because the league wants to promote players that scouts are interested in seeing. Consequently they only hosted a Prospect Game (that also included ex-ohl players). Many loose ends that the league needs to tighten up on going forward.

[Caledonia Fan]

I've been quiet on the topic because I was writing this opinion piece about it. How Many Is Too Many? My take on the issue of 20 year olds.

http://overtimesportsnation.com/how-many-is-too-many/

Why did you put all of Caledonia roster down I don't really understand.Where you trying to show how many 20 year olds Caledonia had the last three years.
There's lot of team's with 20 year olds. 2014 and 2015 there some teams with more 20 year olds than Caledonia. The only differ is Caledonia won two Sutherland Cups.And your numbers are wrong in 2014 Caledonia had seven 20 year olds on there roaster when they won. 4 of these where returnees 3 were brought in. In 2015 Caledonia had nine 20 year olds on there roster when they won the Sutherland Cup.3 where returnees 6 where brought in over the year. You also forgot about our 16 year old that year. Jacob Buch who scored a beautiful goal in the Sutherland Cup playoffs. On a penalty shot against Leamington. Probably will be one of is biggest hockey moments.
On this years roster Caledonia has seventeen 20 year olds. There's 9 or 10 where IN the OHL not 17. 5 are Gojhl returnees.
Your article How Many is Too MANY starts out about Caledonia's 20 year olds. Than you talk about Caledonia's 20 year olds from the OHL.
Then you talk about changing the rules. Are you talking about changing the rules in 20 year olds. Are you talking about changing the rules on OHL 20 year olds. Than you go on and say "I see the point in limiting the number of 20 years old, Bur personally , I don't like it"
Leamington, St Catharines and Guelph all have ten or more 20 year olds on there roster this year.
It does't matter want rules they come up with. They come up with a salary cap . If they could limit teams to five 20 year olds five 19 year olds five 18 year olds five 17 year olds three 16 year olds. The teams that are well coached and well managed will succeed. Like Caledonia

[Caledonia Fan]

We are never going to agree on this and all be on the same page. You have your position, I have mine, and everybody else has there's. But perception is everything. You perceive that I have sour grapes, which I don't. In all honesty, I'm indifferent on Caledonia. All 23 guys could be 20, and from the OHL, and it makes no different to me. Where my team is right now, we are not at the level to be able to compete with them, or for the Sutherland Cup in general, so this doesn't affect me at all.

The reason why I wrote this is because it's a hot button topic and that's what I do. When Chatham ran into their import issue 2 years ago, I wrote about it. Then when St. Catharines ran into it and it looked similar to Chatham's, but they didn't receive the same punishment, I wrote about it. When the rules change, I write about it. When Stratford ran into issues last season with Mitch Vandergunst, I wrote about it. Writing opinion pieces is what I like to do. I feel that it's where I shine and if I could write an opinion piece every week, rather than my previews or reviews, I would, but there's not enough interesting things to write about.

Now, back to perception, a lot of people, not just myself, perceive that they are not developing players, THIS SEASON. I never said anything about last season or the seasons before. I was talking about this season in particular.

In their message to me, Caledonia said that there are a lot of things that they do that myself and the public do not see. That's true of every team. There are things that my Dad and my brother do for the Rockets that, unless you're in the organization, you don't know about.

As an outsider, for this season, it is perceived that unless you have played in the OHL, and have played 100 games or more in the O, you are not good enough to be a Caledonia Corvair. That is how it looks to the rest of us, especially after I broke down their roster. There are guys that were on their team last year, that helped them win a Sutherland Cup, that were traded away this season to make room for Corey Pawley and Tyler Hill and Mitch Fitzmorris and Quentin Maksimovich and etc. This makes it look to the rest of us, at least in my opinion, that the players they had are not good enough for them now.

I don't know want you broke down, there roster. You don't know want your talking about. Connor Patton and Riley Van Hore are the only two guys from last years Sutherland Cup team. The rest move on to higher level of play ( development ) Connor Patton wanted to go back to JR-C - Walkerton. Closer to home and play in front of friends and family. Riley VanHorne was sent to Port Dover. He was the odd man out . Caledonia did all they could to help him find a place to play . And still me close to Mac. for school. VanHorne was sent to Port Dover to make room for Bianchi and Pace who played for Hagersville Hawks last year. You know nothing about the Caledonia Corvairs.

[Port hockey1]

I've been quiet on the topic because I was writing this opinion piece about it. How Many Is Too Many? My take on the issue of 20 year olds.

http://overtimesportsnation.com/how-many-is-too-many/

Why did you put all of Caledonia roster down I don't really understand.Where you trying to show how many 20 year olds Caledonia had the last three years.
There's lot of team's with 20 year olds. 2014 and 2015 there some teams with more 20 year olds than Caledonia. The only differ is Caledonia won two Sutherland Cups.And your numbers are wrong in 2014 Caledonia had seven 20 year olds on there roaster when they won. 4 of these where returnees 3 were brought in. In 2015 Caledonia had nine 20 year olds on there roster when they won the Sutherland Cup.3 where returnees 6 where brought in over the year. You also forgot about our 16 year old that year. Jacob Buch who scored a beautiful goal in the Sutherland Cup playoffs. On a penalty shot against Leamington. Probably will be one of is biggest hockey moments.
On this years roster Caledonia has seventeen 20 year olds. There's 9 or 10 where IN the OHL not 17. 5 are Gojhl returnees.
Your article How Many is Too MANY starts out about Caledonia's 20 year olds. Than you talk about Caledonia's 20 year olds from the OHL.
Then you talk about changing the rules. Are you talking about changing the rules in 20 year olds. Are you talking about changing the rules on OHL 20 year olds. Than you go on and say "I see the point in limiting the number of 20 years old, Bur personally , I don't like it"
Leamington, St Catharines and Guelph all have ten or more 20 year olds on there roster this year.
It does't matter want rules they come up with. They come up with a salary cap . If they could limit teams to five 20 year olds five 19 year olds five 18 year olds five 17 year olds three 16 year olds. The teams that are well coached and well managed will succeed. Like Caledonia

Well said, and I think we can both agree that people are blowing this out of proportion. When people start making quips like calling them "the OHL Corvairs". It screams jealousy.

I'm not aiming that at anyone in specific, just what I've heard in general this season. I can't really blame them for being jealous, I'm a little jealous too. But I can sit there and pretend I don't like them, or get behind what's an amazing team and enjoy it while it lasts.

There's been several dynasty teams in the GHL. Niagara Falls dominated for over ten years, Thorold did the same for several years, including a 36 game unbeaten streak. Then it was St.Catharines turn.

I think it's the ex OHL players that has everyone in a huff. Well, all the other contenders have ex OHLers too! Just because Caledonia scouted properly and was able to get several, people act like this is different when it's not.

Niagara Falls won a pair of cups during their dynasty, Thorold won a cup as well. Both of those teams were good enough to have won several cups in a few years.

The only difference here is, Caledonia looks to be getting done what the others couldn't.

Two years ago everyone was saying the Falcons were better than Caledonia, in fact Caledonia only got 1st place because the Falcons had to forfeit a pair of games for using too many imports.

So it's easy to see the league and fans are making this into something it isn't. As for trading guys that won a cup there last year, when you can upgrade, you do it, right? Plus several great players from last year advanced to higher levels.

I'm glad we're on the same page Caledonia Fan.

[jfvoll]

There's been several dynasty teams in the GHL. Niagara Falls dominated for over ten years, Thorold did the same for several years, including a 36 game unbeaten streak. Then it was St.Catharines turn.

I was talking to someone from Fort Erie and he said Niagara Falls is no longer hated because Masterson sold the team, so I guess the hate has to go somewhere, hence Caledonia.

To be honest, since Caledonia left the Midwest, I have found a new respect for them, especially playing them in the Sutherland Cup semi's back in 2013-14. I remember being in Caledonia for game 3 of the semi's and I started talking to 2 of the Caledonia fans and after they won in OT, one fan put his hand on my shoulder and said Waterloo was better than what the series was at (3-0).

I get that people are upset with the amount of former OHL'ers Caledonia has, but look at St. Catherine's goalie, Joel Horodziejczyk, who's a '95 and has played mainly in the NOJ, but it seems everyone is missing the converse effects of Caledonia, which is, any player who want's to play at a higher level and is currently playing in the GH, are playing against a semi-higher (as terrible as it sounds, the ex-OHL'ers aren't good enough to stay as an O/A or higher, but better than the average Jr. B player) level then the other conferences, but that's just my thinking.

[Port hockey1]

There's been several dynasty teams in the GHL. Niagara Falls dominated for over ten years, Thorold did the same for several years, including a 36 game unbeaten streak. Then it was St.Catharines turn.

I was talking to someone from Fort Erie and he said Niagara Falls is no longer hated because Masterson sold the team, so I guess the hate has to go somewhere, hence Caledonia.

To be honest, since Caledonia left the Midwest, I have found a new respect for them, especially playing them in the Sutherland Cup semi's back in 2013-14. I remember being in Caledonia for game 3 of the semi's and I started talking to 2 of the Caledonia fans and after they won in OT, one fan put his hand on my shoulder and said Waterloo was better than what the series was at (3-0).

I get that people are upset with the amount of former OHL'ers Caledonia has, but look at St. Catherine's goalie, Joel Horodziejczyk, who's a '95 and has played mainly in the NOJ, but it seems everyone is missing the converse effects of Caledonia, which is, any player who want's to play at a higher level and is currently playing in the GH, are playing against a semi-higher (as terrible as it sounds, the ex-OHL'ers aren't good enough to stay as an O/A or higher, but better than the average Jr. B player) level then the other conferences, but that's just my thinking.

Well put.