GOJHL Issues

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RagingBS
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GOJHL Issues

Post by RagingBS » Mon Sep 03, 2018 12:55 pm

Found a very well written article in the Stratford Beacon Herald that seems very unbiased and is consistent with what I have been told.

https://www.stratfordbeaconherald.com/s ... -continues




BeenThereDoneThat
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by BeenThereDoneThat » Mon Sep 03, 2018 10:21 pm

As much as I would like to get into the details of what the reporter reported, I think it may be wise for us to be patient, give it a week or so and lets see what kind of a resolution is found. Remember the OHA has been a concern of many for some time, as has the GOJHL Inc. The OJ has concerns and we all seem to think we know whats going on in the GOJHL Inc. Lets hope the remedy turns out to be good for all that are involved in all levels of Jr. Hockey.

richard
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by richard » Tue Sep 04, 2018 2:06 pm

Should have made a southern ont Jr. a league in first place and all this crap would have been solved and players would be all set to go

RagingBS
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by RagingBS » Tue Sep 04, 2018 5:39 pm

richard wrote:
Tue Sep 04, 2018 2:06 pm
Should have made a southern ont Jr. a league in first place and all this crap would have been solved and players would be all set to go
There should have been, however it is easier said than done now.

All 133 Jr A teams are in the 10 Jr A leagues that are governed by the CJHL. GOJHL Inc attempted to reclassify as Jr A a few years back and the CJHL ruled that they would not allow an 11th Jr A league to form under their umbrella. The GOJHL is within the OHA footprint, so any Jr A entry would have to be in the OHA's only Jr A league, namely the OJHL. Currently Ontario is home to 4 of the 10 Jr A leagues so adding a 5th is highly unlikely.

Unfortunately for your idea to work it can only be changed with the OHA creating a southern division in the OJHL, however the OHA has maintained its need for a Jr B league and the GOJHL is the only Jr B league they currently have.

The best way in my opinion is for the OHA to try to integrate a few (4-5) geographically strategic teams along the 401 corridor along with Brantford into a new division in the OJHL to serve Southwestern Ontario market. Inturn a GOJHL division (5-6 teams) to provide a JR B option in the GTA and East. Longer travel but then the OHA would be covering their footprint in all levels.

Just my opinion, I am sure others have theirs.

richard
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by richard » Tue Sep 04, 2018 6:11 pm

For years I was told jr d teams to jr c could not happen. What happened all d clubs now jr c.. I was told to be impossible back then but it happened for best as d teams can now keep more local players etc.
With oha approval and pressure from oha and b league I am of the belief that for betterment and future of hockey in southwestern Ontario this impossibility can be turned around to satisfy the old saying for the good of hockey in southern Ontario regardless of number of jr a teams, leagues in Ontario, Canada etc.
There can be a b league for c clubs if there is interest or b clubs that wish to stay as they are presently.
In amateur hockey, nothing should be impossible.
Would oha and hockey Canada not lose a lot of revenue if the whole b league left to form there own league outside of hockey Canada. This would not be a good look for anybody.
This will not happen as present operations and operators would not entertain this radicle stance. Which I can understand.

FrozenPonds
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by FrozenPonds » Wed Sep 05, 2018 1:50 pm

The question is not "what is in the best interests of hockey". It is now about what is in the best interests of Hockey Canada amd has been for quite some time. I have been saying this for years that HC only cares about their golf vacays and international hardware. They will always use terms such as rationale and outlaw when it suits the needs of the empire. Yet, very rarely, if even at all, do they provide amswers or rationale when asked. This province is a mess. There are too many hands in the cookie jar and nothing gets accomplished for the betterment of the game. Too much money, politics and control in the game today. Gosh..the days of old with two National orgs may be long gone but...those were some good days!!

Letterkenny68
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by Letterkenny68 » Thu Sep 06, 2018 7:25 am

Just how bad would a B league independent of HC look? Think about the fact that if they operate outside HC then any OHL draft pick that has any desire to affiliate to the major club could NOT play in a league outside of HC sanctioning. Teams struggle to find talent now. Inc going independent is not a good idea, at least without HC sanctioning, and past releases have shown HC has not interest in that.

RocketGirl
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by RocketGirl » Thu Sep 06, 2018 8:09 am

Inc. has no intentions of leaving the OHA or HC. What they want is to have more control of the administration and operation of the league from the OHA.
Queen of the GOJHL

Sometimes you just have to straighten your crown and remind them who they're dealing with.

FrozenPonds
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by FrozenPonds » Thu Sep 06, 2018 10:19 am

For years, the talk about the GMHL was it was a pay to play league and wouldn't survive without sanctioning. It has grown..now the talent is not nearly the same but they have found their niche!!

Again, I will ask...what does the OHA, OHF or HC provide to this league? Is there a National Championship? NO!! Are there tournaments that they can enter against non-league teams? NO! So what exactly, other than the Suthy, does the OHA provide? Oh yeah, insurance..not like that couldn't be replaced!

This league has been stymied by the OHA in it's attempts to operate AS A LEAGUE! They have made decisions that have been overturned..ie Pelham move and any attempt to grow the league has been met with negative reaction from the OHA.

And for those who think that "outlaw" would not work...you may want to look south of the border at the NCDC which is not USA Hockey sanctioned AND IS thriving! They are sending kids to NCAA D1!! They had applied to USA Hockey for Tier II and pulled their application when USA Hockey went against a few of their requests. That takes balls!!

Sometimes, in life, you need to make a stand. I think that is what the GOJHL Inc/GOJHL is doing!

Letterkenny68
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by Letterkenny68 » Thu Sep 06, 2018 10:48 am

I think you missed the point completely. There is no question they can operate as an independent. But with a dwindling talent pool going independent will me some of the best talent found in the GOJHL (OHL draft picks) will not play in an unsanctioned league and remove the opportunity of playing games with their respective OHL club.

coachFloyd
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by coachFloyd » Thu Sep 06, 2018 10:54 am

Letterkenny68 wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 7:25 am
Just how bad would a B league independent of HC look? Think about the fact that if they operate outside HC then any OHL draft pick that has any desire to affiliate to the major club could NOT play in a league outside of HC sanctioning. Teams struggle to find talent now. Inc going independent is not a good idea, at least without HC sanctioning, and past releases have shown HC has not interest in that.
unless the new league is sponsored and affiliated with the OHL and caters to 16-18 yr olds that are of interest to major junior hockey

Letterkenny68
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by Letterkenny68 » Thu Sep 06, 2018 11:11 am

To be affiliated under the OHL still requires HC sanctioning and they eont get that without dealing they the OHA and OHF. What's the next plan?
Can't the Inc just move on and play hockey this season. The continued turmoil is causing further discredit to the league.

FrozenPonds
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by FrozenPonds » Thu Sep 06, 2018 12:07 pm

If the kids are good enough..the OHL will come knocking. HC will have no bearing on that. Sure the hockey purists would like to believe that HC would be able to influence the ownership of OHL teams but I beg to differ. Besides, there have been countless times where HC has taken NCAA players for it's WJC rosters. I am a proponent of hockey in this country. Hockey is described as Canada's game. Sometimes, that slogan is misinterpreted to suggest hockey is Hockey Canada's game.

Sort of the same thing as these "advisors" suggesting in order to get to the next level they must go to the OJHL. I don't agree or believe that one bit. Build a league that caters to the needs of the players, and these kids will have no need to go to the OJHL. But...having to go through this process now, hurts the league as everyones minds are on the task at hand. Postponing the showcase doesn't help either and only benefits the OHA.

At the end of the day...remove the bureaucratic red tape and politics and get the game where it once was...about these kids who live and breathe to play it!

richard
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by richard » Thu Sep 06, 2018 1:32 pm

I have had the privilege of owning,managing and operating senior,intermediate and junior franchises within the oha for over two decades before leaving on a disappointed note unfortunately.
The oha is a decent operating outfit but is off course in southern Ontario with the junior b teams.
Hopefully, down the hockey road the b clubs and oha will strive together for the same things.
I will keep following the b loop regardless. I do thank the b operators who are trying there best to improve there league and eventually help players.
Thanks again

ILuvHackey
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by ILuvHackey » Thu Sep 06, 2018 2:28 pm

FrozenPonds wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 12:07 pm
If the kids are good enough..the OHL will come knocking. HC will have no bearing on that. Sure the hockey purists would like to believe that HC would be able to influence the ownership of OHL teams but I beg to differ. Besides, there have been countless times where HC has taken NCAA players for it's WJC rosters. I am a proponent of hockey in this country. Hockey is described as Canada's game. Sometimes, that slogan is misinterpreted to suggest hockey is Hockey Canada's game.

Sort of the same thing as these "advisors" suggesting in order to get to the next level they must go to the OJHL. I don't agree or believe that one bit. Build a league that caters to the needs of the players, and these kids will have no need to go to the OJHL. But...having to go through this process now, hurts the league as everyones minds are on the task at hand. Postponing the showcase doesn't help either and only benefits the OHA.

At the end of the day...remove the bureaucratic red tape and politics and get the game where it once was...about these kids who live and breathe to play it!
That wasn't what was said. If a player plays in an outlaw league, he is not allowed to play in a Hockey Canada sanctioned game for a full year. Meaning that if OHL Draft picks play in an outlaw league, they are unable to practice or AP with their OHL club that season. That removes a lot of players from even entertaining playing in an unsanctioned league.

FrozenPonds
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by FrozenPonds » Thu Sep 06, 2018 5:03 pm

I think it would be interesting to see if that did happen! Hockey Canada are not lawmakers despite what some of them have stated in the past. A good lawyer would tear that "suspension" to pieces. And quite frankly, HC doesn't need anymore bad PR!

But, hoping that things resolve themselves but when you have two potentially stubborn groups going head to head....it could be a very long process. That is unless, changes are made.

RagingBS
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by RagingBS » Thu Sep 06, 2018 6:45 pm

If a player participates in any way shape or form with a non sanctioned league after Sept 30 of a given year the player shall be suspended from any Hockey Canada sanctioned activity for the remainder of the current season. This means if the player is released in November from the non sanctioned team he is still ineligible. It also means that the player cannot affiliate or practice with any sanctioned team as well. The World Junior Tournament Prospects games etc are all sanctioned events. Players from NCAA can participate because the NCAA is sanctioned.

The ban also applies to managers coaches trainers and referees. The differences are that there is no automatic reinstatement or cut off date for them. A referee for example that worked an unsanctioned league game they would need to re apply to Hockey Canada after 1 year before being allowed to work again. These applications take time to be resolved if ever.

As far as suing Hockey Canada, good luck with that. This would be as successful as suing the coach to get more powerplay time. As long as national hockey organizations are recognized as the sole governing bodies it won't change.

None of the GOJHL teams have any interest in joining or becoming an unsanctioned league. The teams I have seen in the GMHL would struggle with most mid pack Jr C teams. No one wants to be them and they aren't Jr A by a long shot. There are 2 visions in the GOJHL, both have merit. Neither is all bad. The 25+/- teams need to come up with an amicable solution that will serve the players properly. If it is one B league or two B leagues the teams have to fall under the OHA and abide by their rules and regulations. Trying to kick each other out, and spreading false rumours about other franchises does not improve the league image overall. It is important to operate a respectful league. It looks professional that way.

They have several months ahead to come up with a suitable plan that is best for the players in the league. The circus from the summer of 2018 needs to end and not be repeated. With flexibility on both sides it can be acheived

Letterkenny68
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by Letterkenny68 » Thu Sep 06, 2018 7:28 pm

Very well stated RagingBS!

RocketGirl
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by RocketGirl » Sat Sep 08, 2018 10:25 pm

Here's another story, it's taken another turn.

https://www.stratfordbeaconherald.co ... r-twist
Queen of the GOJHL

Sometimes you just have to straighten your crown and remind them who they're dealing with.

richard
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by richard » Sun Sep 09, 2018 1:20 pm

Sometimes every hockey organization (oha) needs an overhaul, recharging, change in direction from same old from the past. oha must come to grips with the idea that oha book allows for teams or league to compete in Jr. a,b,c, and d.
To not allow Jr. a teams, league to compete for oha Jr. A cup in southern Ontario by surpressing and turning away interested teams, parties despite and over looking their own rule book in what they deem in the best interests of hockey players, teams in southern Ontario. Is it really in best interests of players and good for hockey in southern ont?

ILuvHackey
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by ILuvHackey » Thu Sep 13, 2018 10:52 am

Brantford's JR A game tonight postponed because the OHA won't send them referees.

Are people seeing it now? The OHA is a mess and creating the problem.

RocketGirl
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by RocketGirl » Thu Sep 13, 2018 11:28 am

According to the OJ forum, the OHA hasn't actually approved the move from Milton. They were saying that their home games were being moved to their opposition's arena, because they aren't approved to play out of the Gretszky. Perhaps that's why they're still wearing their Milton uniforms.
Queen of the GOJHL

Sometimes you just have to straighten your crown and remind them who they're dealing with.

ILuvHackey
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by ILuvHackey » Thu Sep 13, 2018 11:40 am

RocketGirl wrote:
Thu Sep 13, 2018 11:28 am
According to the OJ forum, the OHA hasn't actually approved the move from Milton. They were saying that their home games were being moved to their opposition's arena, because they aren't approved to play out of the Gretszky. Perhaps that's why they're still wearing their Milton uniforms.
But they sent refs for their pre-season games at Gretzky with no problem.

In essence, the OJ seems to be saying the same thing as the GOJHL. "We want control of our league, just like every good junior hockey league across Canada."

RocketGirl
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by RocketGirl » Thu Sep 13, 2018 11:54 am

Well the OHA is mad now, so that's the team they can screw over right now from the OJ.

I don't know how you overthrow the OHA, but I think it'll happen, and this split in our league will happen too.

I have a lot of respect for the OHA and Karen Phibbs, but I don't agree with how things have been handled the last few years. I don't know who is in control at the OHA, but I think Karen is their puppet and is doing what they want, not necessarily what's best for the leagues or the game.
Queen of the GOJHL

Sometimes you just have to straighten your crown and remind them who they're dealing with.

coachFloyd
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by coachFloyd » Thu Sep 13, 2018 1:01 pm

I've heard just enough that if 10% of it is true the OHA board will be dissolved and re-structured and I hope a civil suit follows

RagingBS
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by RagingBS » Thu Sep 13, 2018 1:01 pm

Statement from the OJHL
http://ojhl.pointstreaksites.com/view/o ... ews_509272
Not sure if anyone has considered the end game but if this team move was an issue the time to object to it should have long past. I imagine there is a lot of potential litigation from players to sponsors to ticket holders should the OHA not get their $hit together. How does a governing body neglect to make a ruling on a team transfer that was announced publicly 5-6 months ago? How does a governing body sit back and not try to mediate a solution to the turmoil in the GOJHL? Somewhere there is a lack of responsible leadership within the OHA to prevent this potential disasters from becoming real disasters.

Ron
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by Ron » Thu Sep 13, 2018 1:08 pm

Now let's just throw in a rumour heard at a Junior C game last night- a group from Burlington has put in a bid to buy the GOJHL Brantford franchise and move it to the Wave there (worst plac ever to wtch a hockey game).

coachFloyd
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by coachFloyd » Thu Sep 13, 2018 1:20 pm

just counting the days...

RagingBS
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by RagingBS » Thu Sep 13, 2018 2:09 pm

Ron wrote:
Thu Sep 13, 2018 1:08 pm
Now let's just throw in a rumour heard at a Junior C game last night- a group from Burlington has put in a bid to buy the GOJHL Brantford franchise and move it to the Wave there (worst plac ever to wtch a hockey game).
I am not sure that it is worse the Brantford Lions Park Arena

ILuvHackey
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Re: GOJHL Issues

Post by ILuvHackey » Thu Sep 13, 2018 4:44 pm

RagingBS wrote:
Thu Sep 13, 2018 2:09 pm
Ron wrote:
Thu Sep 13, 2018 1:08 pm
Now let's just throw in a rumour heard at a Junior C game last night- a group from Burlington has put in a bid to buy the GOJHL Brantford franchise and move it to the Wave there (worst plac ever to wtch a hockey game).
I am not sure that it is worse the Brantford Lions Park Arena
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